Guys, I need some serious advice

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheEngineer

ok so he did a compression test but that doesnt tell you that the car has bad valves. It might be other stuff. Without taking apart the head its impossible to check valves. That is the most likely thing wrong. But it looks like only 2 and 3 may be the bads ones. If thats the case its possible that it could be the head gasket that went. Does your car throw a check engine light? I can't tell because the car won't start. I believe the lights do turn on at first whenever you turn the key, but the relevance can only be measured if they still stay on after the car starts, right?

PS: I dont think running out of gas caused your engine to have no compression. Of course not, because I'm sure this has happened to many people (running a car out of gas) and after priming the fuel injectors, usually that fixes the problem. However, what I'm trying to say is that I believe it's something the man from Autozone did. I know nothing about cars mechanically, so I would have never even thought of taking the steps he did mechanically. All I was doing was turning the key to try to crank the engine when he told me to. Remember my car is MFI, not a car with a carburetor. Do you get my gist? I would ask him to do a leakdown test and see what he gets with that. At least then you can see if its the seals. I may do that, thanks for the suggestion. However, I refuse to spend any more money until the mechanic at the shop can explain to me, based on his professional opinion, what could have caused this much damage to my car when it was running fine before it ran out of gas.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheEngineer

Well for valves to be bent they would have had to hit the pistons and for that to happen the timing belt would have had to slip, so the other thing to look as it signs of wear on the belt or if it snapped. The mechanic acknowledged two possibilities. One was precisely what you said. Bent valves as a result of a coincidence; the timing belt snapping the day I got my car to run. However, this car has not been driven anywhere near 60,000 miles since the valves, head and timing belt were replaced. Also, when I was driving it, I believe I was either in 1st or 2nd gear going certainly around 10-15 mph. I had just turned into a residential area off of a major street so I could turn around, because I was going the wrong way (I'm new to this area, just moved from out of state). The car simply came to a gradual stop, I looked at my gas meter, and it was pretty much on or near E. Now, if the timing belt had indeed snapped, what signs would indicate that? Would it make an audible noise? Seeing as it includes a belt snapping inside the engine, slapping several valves hard enough to bend them, etc, there was certainly no indication that such damage had occurred. What kinds of sounds should you expect to hear if the timing belt snaps during regular driving? I still dont see anything that guy did at autozone make this big an impact on your car. The 2nd possibility, the mechanic said, is that it had more to do with spraying starter fluid into a fuel-injected car (as opposed to a car with a carburetor). It sometimes works in small amounts with minimal damage to your car, however he explained to me that spraying it directly onto the air-filter is a no-no because it acts as a sponge, and absorbs the ether. When you try to crank your car, it sucks all of that through the intake at once. He says this will do damage. He says it can likely lead to severe engine damage such as broken valves, pistons, rods, etc, these are all the words of the professional I spoke to today. Further, the man from Autozone went on to spray the fluid into one of the hoses to the right of the air filter, presumably also leading to the intake. I could not see how much he used. Bottom line, the mechanic said, insight can only be gained by taking the engine apart to a degree and checking the valves. He says if he sees imprints on them and if they are bent, along with a broken timing belt, then it's clear to see why my car stopped running. However, if he sees black marks associated with extreme heating, then it's also a very clear conclusion to be drawn. Of course, his shop will certainly charge an arm and leg for all that labor+diagnostics, so I'm towing my vehicle back into my vicinities and having my uncle and his mechanic friends do the same work most likely for free. We may see a broken timing belt AND severe burns from the starter fluid. Bottom line is the man from Autozone followed the wrong procedure, even if it's ok to use a little bit of starting fluid. But typically you only need a little squirt, maybe 2 seconds or less directly into the intake, and that's it. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work, you don't simply keep trying to use this highly volatile and flammable substance, cranking the car 15 times. You also spray it directly into the intake, not onto the filter itself. Then you don't spray it into a nearby intake hose if that doesn't work. Again, I could not see how much he actually used, but I physically saw him spray it onto the filter and then into the hose, and I know he did it at least a few more times after that. So even if the timing belt did indeed snap, it's unlikely that my rpm was high enough to cause all this damage, since there were definitely zero audible indications of such damage. The starting fluid, in either case, did some kind of substantial damage.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheEngineer

ok so he did a compression test but that doesnt tell you that the car has bad valves. It might be other stuff. Without taking apart the head its impossible to check valves. That is the most likely thing wrong. But it looks like only 2 and 3 may be the bads ones. If thats the case its possible that it could be the head gasket that went. Does your car throw a check engine light?

PS: I dont think running out of gas caused your engine to have no compression. Right, and according to the mechanic I spoke to, the misuse of starter fluid could have caused similar results. I would ask him to do a leakdown test and see what he gets with that. At least then you can see if its the seals.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheEngineer

Well here is what is throwing me off. First is that because your car ran out of gas one of the main reasons it may not start is that your fuel pump is gone. Its common that youll burn out the pump because you ran it dry. Definitely sounds like the case. After this whole incident I did some reading about what happens when you run a car out of gas, and those sources also said that the fuel pump can fall prey to getting severely clogged by sediment and whatnot that sits in the bottom of the fuel tank. This is a 17 year old car, so you're probably right. My fuel filter needs work. However the whole compression thing is really messing me up. It is totally unrelated. The only way i can see it being related is that the starter fluid caused you to burn up the valve seals or something. Yeah that's why it was so shocking to hear about all this "internal engine damage". If indeed the car simply ran out of gas and the timing belt didn't give out (and I don't see why it should've), the only other possibility is that the misuse of starter fluid caused some serious heat damage to the valves. It sounds like that's a very likely scenario based on what procedures the man from Autozone followed (sraying it onto the air filter directly, also spraying it into one of the intake hoses, and simply using too much of it). And like you said your car just died from no fuel. I dont see from what you said anything really pointing to the timing belt now. Yeah, I'm crossing my fingers. Maybe the mechanic messed up the compression test. Here is what i would have your uncle do:

1. Check the fuel pump and see if its functioning, or try replacing it.
2. Re-do the compression test to check the mechanics #'s. (just FYI standard compression is 164psi)
3. If they fail still put alittle oil in the cylinder and re-do the compression test to see if the #'s improve. If they do then its the piston rings. if they dont significantly improve then you need to do a leakdown test.